From sde@golden.net Sat Feb 21 08:00:08 PST 1998 On Wed, 18 Feb 1998 17:30:03 -0800, "Jon Harris" wrote: >I've seen a bevy of posts lately with people listing reverse curls in their >arm routine. I assume this means doing biceps curls with an overhand grip, >rather than the typical underhand grip. Is this correct? If so, what is >the point of this exercise? Does doing reverse curls work the biceps or >other muscles in some other beneficial way than regular barbell curls? >I've been following Sandeep's recommendation and doing primarily barbell >preacher curls and incline dumbbell curls, with a few sets of cable curls >thrown in for good measure. Am I missing something by not doing reverse >curls? The biceps have an ineffective line of pull when the palms are turned down. Hence when the elbow is flexed the brachialis must work harder to move the load. The brachialis lies underneath the biceps and when developed adds thickness to the arm and helps push the biceps brachii up higher - creating the illusion of a peak. Specific brachialis work i.e. reverse grip curls can aid both arm development and strength development. However, if you make use of overhand grip chins, your brachialis is going to be torched anyways and I really doubt specific brachialis work is going to be necessary. Don't forget it's involvement in other pulling exercises with the palm in any position other than facing upwards. ------ ------ Sandeep De The Power Factory - http://www.geocities.com/HotSprings/4039/ "The truth hurts. Maybe not as much as jumping on a bicycle with no seat, but it still hurts." From ROBO and Sonia Sat Feb 21 08:00:19 PST 1998 "Jon Harris" said: >I've seen a bevy of posts lately with people listing reverse curls in their >arm routine. I assume this means doing biceps curls with an overhand grip, >rather than the typical underhand grip. Is this correct? If so, what is >the point of this exercise? Does doing reverse curls work the biceps or >other muscles in some other beneficial way than regular barbell curls? >I've been following Sandeep's recommendation and doing primarily barbell >preacher curls and incline dumbbell curls, with a few sets of cable curls >thrown in for good measure. Am I missing something by not doing reverse >curls? reverse curls directly stress the brachialis and brachioradialis. the brachialis is the muscle typically associated wit hhaving "lower biceps", and the brachioradialis is teh muscle on the posterior forearm (hairy part) which bulges up when you turn your hand away from your body and flex your biceps. Revesre curls are okay, but not totally necessary unless your upper arms are huge, and your forearms are really miniscule. ROBO and Sonia beare at mindspring dot com ICQ - 3004798 From jdenny@erols.com Sat Feb 21 08:03:08 PST 1998 Jon Harris wrote in message <6cg1uj$j3g@ratty.wolfe.net>... >I've seen a bevy of posts lately with people listing reverse curls in their >arm routine. I assume this means doing biceps curls with an overhand grip, >rather than the typical underhand grip. Is this correct? If so, what is >the point of this exercise? Does doing reverse curls work the biceps or >other muscles in some other beneficial way than regular barbell curls? >I've been following Sandeep's recommendation and doing primarily barbell >preacher curls and incline dumbbell curls, with a few sets of cable curls >thrown in for good measure. Am I missing something by not doing reverse >curls? >-- Yes, you are. Reverse curls (RC) work the arms in a different fashion than with an underhand grip. RC work the brachialis to a much greater degree. If you are trying to increase arm size you should definitely be training the brachialis, this muscle lies underneath both heads of the biceps brachii (when maximally developed it can be seen from the side of the upper arm[if you have low bf]), it is responsible for the peak in your biceps; which is created when the brachialis pushes up on the biceps brachii. Every arm routine should include an exercise to work the brachialis. Don't get me wrong, it will be stimulated in most biceps exercises, but it should also receive more direct stimulation. Another note on RC, it is best (IMO) to do them with an EZ-Curl bar as this reduces stress on the wrists. An additional benefit of RC is that they also heavily stimulate the brachioradialis, the band-like muscle on the forearm that connects above the elbow. There are quite a number of exercises for stimulating the brachialis, here's a partial list: Zottman Curls Seated Incline Hammer Curls Hammer Curls (to a lesser extent than the above) Spider curls Preacher Curls on the Vertical Face (pretty much a Spider Curl) Cable Curl Downs on a High Pulley (this will show you how weak you are) There are more, and the above have many variations, but this should give you a good selection for changing your arm routine. P.S. When you include RC in your routine try them at this tempo 4/2/2 (That's a 4sec negative, 2sec pause, and 2sec positive -- the 2sec pause should be completed at about 30 degrees of elbow flexion, then continue the lift. If you have to sway to restart the lift you are using too much weight). From sde@golden.net Sat Feb 21 08:03:56 PST 1998 On Thu, 19 Feb 1998 17:17:02 GMT, mcurfma#@nswc.navy.mil (MarkBC) wrote: >Second, is the brachialis responsible for the biceps peak? Isn't >the main effect of a larger brachialis simply a larger appearing >arm? Isn't a noticeable peak more the result of good genetics? Genetics are the biggest influence on the shape your muscle has when contracted. But anatomically speaking, if you increase the size of the foundation, you are going to physically push something higher, no? Say you built a hut on top of a wooden post. You're afraid of MFW so you decide to become a hermit. If you increased the size of the wooden post, you'd be higher in the sky, so that when you pull out your rifle to pick us all off, Jason Burnell would have to pull out his longer range rifle to air condition your skull? Right? Are you following me on this one? C'mon guys, can't you see it? >Third, what is the advantage, or reason, for doing various incline >curls? That is, what is the difference between doing simple seated >dumbbell curls and doing incline dumbbell curls? Incline curls cause your humerous to move behind the midline of your body. What this does is stretch the biceps slightly. It also eliminates cheating to a certain extent. If you place your arms behind you on something and lower your body sufficiently, you will feel a stretch in your biceps, even though your arms are completely straight. That isn't the best explanation, but I'm still quite amused with the picture of you sitting atop a telephone poll, for no reason at all, shooting Mike Lane, and then Deepsquatter emptying a clip into your head. Not that I want to see you dead or anything. ------ ------ Sandeep De The Power Factory - http://www.geocities.com/HotSprings/4039/ "The truth hurts. Maybe not as much as jumping on a bicycle with no seat, but it still hurts." From mshinoha@u.washington.edu Tue Apr 14 21:35:35 PDT 1998 Christopher Cook wrote: > I suspect the culprit really is the preacher curls ... > > The tendon that seems to really kill is the one somehow related to my > pinky finger, like I'm gripping too hard or something. > > Any similar experiences or advice? Preacher curls! this is EXACTLY what did it to me....i have a case of tendonitis in my wrist which flared up after going up in weight (and sets) on preacher curls. i don't know if it's a grip thing or what, but i think i'm going to have to do them with free weights from now on. I don't know what to tell you about other exercises, but I can say ice (4X/day, 20 min. ea time!) and anti-inflammatories and rest. That's been working pretty well for me so far (i'll let you know what happens after tonight though - first workout for 2 weeks since the tendonitis hit). When I was doing the preacher curls, i was using an ez curl bar - i was thinking of trying a straight bar, or maybe just doing standing curls. I know that right after doing preacher curls my forearms ached and i felt pressure in my wrists but i ignored it (never a good idea...). No more, I suppose. Good luck to you, and take it easy! MMS Subject: Killer Triceps Workout From: Wedderburn <40959@www1.utech.net> Date: Sun, 31 May 1998 08:26:19 -0700 I've had several requests to repeat Charles Poliquin's killer triceps work out, and thought it best to just post it to Weights. This was a routine Charles designed for Milos Sarcev. The instructions are to perform this entire circuit three times a week for 6 weeks. Frankly, if I had done that, my arms would have probably fallen off. I did one tricep superset three times and could hardly move. I have also included the bicep routines that went along with the tricep torture. If Mishko could get through this whole thing in one workout he's gotta be on the juice. I'd also suggest that anyone who has a bit of experience purchase themselves a copy of "The Poliquin Principles." Do you sell this one, MTS? If not, you can get it through www.musclemedia.com. [It's listed in the WeightsNet Bookstore but the link doesn't go to Amazon.com. Instead, it goes to another site where you can order the book. -MTS] Here goes: Circuit One: bicep curls, staggered grip superset 1. Standing Reverse grip EZ bar curls, 5-7 rm on a 321 tempo; no rest 2. Seated hammer DB curls, 10-12 rm, 302 tempo, rest 10 sec 3. Scott EZ bar semi-supinated curls w/shoulder width grip to failure, 202 tempo. 2 min rest period while you curse him and his descendants. Repeat steps 1-3 twice; Poliquin says you will probably have to drop the weight 5# every new set. Circuit 2 - triceps extensions/presses (triceps thrasher {this is what the book says!} 1. lying BB tricept to top of forehead, 6-9 rm, 221 tempo, rest 10 sec. 2. Lying bb triceps to chin, 6-9 rm, 301 tempo, rest 10 sec 3. Close grip benches to failure, 221 tempo, rest 2 min Repeat twice, again probably having to drop the weight Circuit 3 - Incline curls superset 1. incline hammer DB curls, 4-6 rm, 401 tempo, rest 10 sec 2. Incline DB curls, 301 tempo, rest 10 sec 3. Incline elbows-out DB curls to failure, 201 tempo. Rest 2 minutes Repeat twice using the same dumbells throughout (Oh, phleeeze, Chas, can't I drop poundage?!) Circuit 4 - triceps pressdown superset 1. tri pressdowns, close grip, 8-10 rm, 401 tempo, rest 10 sec 2. tri pressdowns, medium grip, to failure, 301 tempo, rest 10 sec 3. reverse grip tri pressdowns to failure, 201 tempo, rest 2 minutes Repeat twice, dropping weight 10-20 pounds (more like 5 in my case) on step No. 3 to get the reps in. I did not work triceps and biceps on the same day, but did one superset for each on their respective training days. Did the same superset for 3 weeks, then changed over to the other one. I found these to be very effective. If you like this kind of stuff, Poliquin's book is full of tortuous little routines like this. Plus some very good advice. Happy lifting -- Rosemary